Thank you for pointing out the obvious to me . It also seems hard to argue that the stock 4-link/metric cars have a hard time being competive in our SS/Sportsman classes where a stock suspension is mandated. Aug 24th 2005. Excessive front toe in will make a car turn into a corner quicker, & may create a loose condition. We cover all forms of racing in the Midwest featuring racing news, results, photos & videos. would be able to run on asphalt with the leaf spring cars. In order to slow you must lose (kinetic) energy. Setup Tips for Asphalt Oval Racing 97 to 2004 set up sheet for stock metric lowers ride height lf 3 1 2 to 4 rf 4 1 2 lr 11 1 4 to 11 1 2 rr 11 1 2 4 link amp 3 link lf 1100 rf 1000 these spring rates are a good starting point some tracks call for a little less and some for a more don t listen to your buddies on spring rates because different, the 4 5 / 20 After you get the cross weight where you want it, adjust the ride heights. If you find that the left rear is the coolest tire on the car, then you have a setup balance problem where the rear is too stiff. I have found that these are the best ways to adjust iRacing setups to suit your driving style, or to handle better under different temperature conditions. Jul 25, 2011. Adjust the cross weight for more extreme conditions or different circumstances. Pay attention to the left front tire temperatures versus the left rear. This will help keep your ride heights in the ballpark. Add Comment. var email = "RacelineCentral" Splash = 2-3 gallons, 1/2 can = 5-6 gallons, 1 can = 11-12 gallons, 1 1/2 cans = 17-18 gallons, 2 cans = full tank. More has to be done to help the rear roll to match the front. Chassis. That was it. competition. The cross weight adjustments should work on all dirt cars except the Sprint Cars. We have been softening those setups over the years, but never intended to go to coil bind or bump rubbers. The cars with the stock metric 4 link all seem to go into a four wheel drift and are always loose on exit. Rear Geometry The less fuel in the tank the tighter the chassis will become. To download a copy of the E-book, simplyclick on the link below. Required fields are marked *. A set up plan will help you to build a race winning effort. Both of these are necessary components that will be needed to win championships. SR10 Dirt Oval RTR | Associated Electrics Then all you have to do is maintain that balance throughout the season and that means resisting making changes that take you outside that envelope. by . I would like know what the ic would be on a g body with a 9 inch in the rear with stock suspension. Nick might be a better theory guy but I don't think that just adding a panhard bar will get you there. It costs just as much money, if not more, to run poorly, so you might as well learn to run well. By Bob Bolles, Circle Track Magazine . I will post as I no longer race, the biggest thing is the angle of the upper and lower control arms in the rear, you need to understand roll center and instant center to be able to adjust it correctly. Johnson Chassis Inc It is not advantageous to have the rearend steer to the right at any time on asphalt. To sort of act as a pull bar? We can add the stiffer bushings to most of the points, but leave several, one at the top and one at the bottom, as a rubber bushing to absorb the torque created in roll. Setup & Tech Info - Jet Racing Inc Posted October 3, 2005. Just giving the car more rear traction, period, does not help us if the car becomes too tight in the middle of the turns and we could end up with the reverse of what we need. It just won't work. Dirt Modified IMCA, Local Tracks. 5. This guide covers much of the basics for the less experienced sim racer as well as a troubleshooting section that should help reduce your lap times. We are at a crossroads at this point in time with setup technology in asphalt racing. This configuration is common in General Motors cars built in and around the 1980's as well as some Ford cars, such as the Thunderbird, from the same time period. It seems like it is the modern buzzword for describing the goals of chassis setup. Grill tape is nothing more than duct tape. Pavement Modifieds. MSRP: $515.99. It's on a car that I'm helping with. Has boxed lowers, adjustable uppers , stock springs and shock. Disconnect the sway bar and zero (unload) it. These are the general rules unless you are trying to "tie down" a corner. If all of these issues are evaluated and corrected, then you can move on. I drive both a metric (my truck) and a leaf spring car (ss). Understanding corner weights | Articles | Grassroots Motorsports RacelineCentral is not responsible for the accuracy of this document, If you are an owner, sponsor, or mentioned here, Please feel free to contact us below for updating. Metric Rearend Suspension Video from a Street Stock On the a street stock what size spring would be better to run on the rear. Each suspension system desires to do its own thing when lateral forces are introduced from the car going through the turns. In Stock. Everything you need to know to build, set-up and race a Street Stock competitively. If it is too far to one side, then changes to the brake master cylinder sizes and/or the pad compounds might need to be made in order to maintain a centered-bias adjuster. A slight amount of rear steer to the left has been shown to help provide more traction at the rear and bite off the corners where it is needed. From NE Ohio to North Central Mississippi, everyone has their own ideas and preferences for what they will plant this year. Here are some recommendations. Numerous car builders have come to realize the truth in the above statements. I drove the #01 ss for two years and tried everything I could think of within the rules and it was a hard job to keep the car in control because of the binding of the rear suspension. Did they allow weight jacks? sj_valley_dave wrote on 05/01/09 at 12:12pm: I spoke with Dave24 after last weekend, he dropped the fronts down to 700 LF and 800 RF and got the cross down to 45.8%, pulled the bolt out and floated the RR spring. We also discuss how to identify the cause and the best treatments for each type of pest. The front geometry on a metric car isnt as good as a Camaro though. 1. RAceman. A good handling car can make gobs of horsepower and hook it up. So don't try it. The lateral location of the third link can affect the distribution of load among the two rear tires that results from acceleration and antisquat. I want to try a reverse spring set up on a hobby stock car that am helping a friends with its a 3400 lbs metric car all stock. That move took this design to the next level. Compare that to an asphalt Late Model car with a rear Panhard or J-bar and a 10-inch rear RC height and a 15.5 inch CG height. That extra effort is what separates the front runners from the rest of the field. In the last article, I talked about the uses of toe and how it affects both drivability and front-end dynamics. Metric Four-Link Suspension Design - Circle Track Magazine - MotorTrend If you could slide the MC to the right, or outside of the turn for you road racers, the front end will get stiffer. Basically, if the suspension mounting points must remain stock, the leaf spring cars will dominate (at least on ashpalt.). Heck, if you are paying 20 bucks to get into the pits you might . But there is still some changes to be made from track to track. Off-centered adjusters can be very inconsistent. With allot of experimenting I found a way to really get the car to hook up. The 1st thing we will need to do is look at the car, where are we with your current setup and how far can we go with that setup. Setup Balance This is our 1988 Monte Carlo Stock Appearing Body. At some point, we take in enough information to allow us to avoid the mistakes of the past and get ahead of the curve in setting up our asphalt cars. Use the "new" 7 inch arm on the RH and the 8.5 on the LH. Then it's done! Current Stock: Quantity: Decrease Quantity: Increase Quantity: Save to Wishlist. Swap Option: Medieval will build the chassis using one of our sandblasted frames. Lowering the rear RC and softening the RR spring will help solve the problem. Setup Tips: These tips are for an independent a-arm front suspension and 3-link rear suspension type of car, but may apply to other types of suspensions as well. Administrator. Each setup has a life cycle or a time frame in which it will work before we run into a stopping point with it. The RC height will move with vertical movement of the rear of the car. .220 to .235 would be fine without a quickner. ford 9' rear end w/disc brakes, stocks, springs, gauges just add motor and transmission and go racing. If the car feels loose on corner entry, lower the left track bar. Still, teams want the most they can get out of their cars and if all of the above nine items are in order, by all means, go ahead with aero tweaking. The engine should always be aligned perpendicular to the rearend and/or parallel to the centerline of the car. I haven't plotted it all out but four links, none of which are at the axis of rotation, would tend to fight each other as body rolls. Wheel Covers. I ran a metric street stock at HMP for a number of years and was definitely not at a disadvantage. Car went anywhere he wanted and was quick time, won the trophy dash, heat . Stock Car Racing, NASCAR, Late Model, Sooner Speedway, Frost Racing Team, Race Links, Chevy Monte Carlo . FOR 78-88 GM METRIC CARS. How to Open the Setups. Did not get DQ'd but after the race the promoter told him that too many other cars were complaining and he would not be able to run the car in that class. 358091 FAB IMPALA, NO UPPER MOUNTS. The images used are taken from the iRacing Super Late Model setup screen. I was just trying to help a guy asking about what is done to the chassis. Triangulated 4-Links: Make Your Stock Suspension Car Work I measured ours at close to 20". Estler's Mortgage Lifter is ideal for growing in northern climates due to its ability to withstand cooler temperatures better than other varieties. The effect is huge. After payment you will be directed to a download page. Your email address will not be published. the force of air. If we can raise the upper front link mounts, we can lower the rear RC by lowering the upper IC. For example, if your initial setup is 52 percent cross-weight, and you want 50 percent cross-weight, lowering the right front or left rear corner will decrease cross-weight percentage. Ok im building a new circle track car useing a 1981 Camaro. METRIC CROW FOOT Other Items Online Auctions Oct 12, 2013 #2. Send your request to bob.bolles@sorc.com. Setup Tips for Metric on asphalt. We had LF 1000, RF1300, LR 200, RR200. Thank you, that forum is a wealth of information. Thats the theory and the science anyway. Cars that don't turn well are very likely to have poor MC designs. LIT-721 80293NDP 2009-2015 Cadillac CTS-V HE. I would trail brake or lift earlier. You can then make fine adjustments with the sway bar preload if desired. See All - Best Selling. The "ULTIMATE" Racing Car Chassis Setup Guide and Tutorial Nick and I agree on something! My old car had a stock frame front to back with just the suspension pick-up points changed, it took a lot of trial and error over three years to get a good baseline for most tracks. This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies. I feel the metrics should definitely be allowed panhard bars and rear weight jacks. Metrics can be competitive IF they are permitted to address their four-point rear suspension problems. Since the spring promotes rebound and resists compression as inherent properties, then the shock rate of compression control must be less than the rate of rebound control. This setup guide also has new information based on the changes that go along with the new version of the sim. document.write("" + contact + "" + "") Always try to start with the track bars first. I ran a street stock/sportsman from 1995 to 2000 with a metric frame. It may take a few test sessions to help you determine your balance, but if you observe the indicators correctly, then tuning the car for dynamic balance can be done. Last couple of years I ran the car we just used tubular ones with rod ends because it was legal and easier. Most good cars are built on wheel scales. If we arrange our control arm angles, from a side view, for antidive, then as the car dives the upper BJ would move to the rear and the bottom BJ would move to the front. I think I'll make a proposal along these lines. The very last thing you need to worry about is your aero package. Bush i agree with your Eriez/ 7 comment. Am I correct that you would reattach the sway bar after making the perch adjustments? The less angle the better. Circle Track Chassis Choice | NastyZ28.com Remember, we're still using stock components, we're just making small relocations of those points. It must show a consistent gain in performance and a logical ideology to the bulk of race teams. We were allowed weight jacks and after market uppers in front also. lol Stocks are turning the same times as emods at most tracks these days, maybe not the top 3 emods, but pretty much the same wich is crazy. Russet mites are a type of pest that can cause damage to leaves, stems, and petioles. A spring split of 250-lb/in spring in the left rear and 200-lb/in spring in the right rear is common. This will loosen the car, and that's undesirable, especially on dirt. Racing Aspirations refers to this point as the roll center (RC), but it can also referred to as the moment center. ! I see the times at CCMS are identical, THR the truck .5 sec quicker. Metric Chassis Roll Centers - Lone Star Speedzone Forums Keep It Fast and Cheap. You might try a little trail braking. Create New Wish List . In the same manner, we can lower the rear mount of the upper link and lower the upper IC. Brake Bias CRA street stock. AFCO C1 METRIC PADS. $137.99. Antisquat is detrimental to corner entry. Much of the same information translates over to NASCAR Racing as well. 10702FMI FRAME & CAGE - FAB IMPALA MOD. About Us. Good luck and keep the rubber side down!!! It may not display this or other websites correctly. Mod Four Tech. Balance is spoken of in all types of motorsports these days, even F1. With all the negative BS that tends to permiate these boards these days, I thought maybe we could talk about something real and constructive. . How do I tighten or loosen the car on entry? Long gone are the days of saying that the MC is not important. Flat Tracks: On an asphalt car, utilizing slightly stiffer rebound on the left side, while softening the rebound on the right side, will generally enhance the handling of the car. The amount of difference you need is directly influenced by the installed motion ratio of the spring and the spring rate. Dirt Race Life is explaining how to draw out the front end on a race car and determine where the roll center is. If we have a top view difference in alignment between the transmission output shaft and the pinion shaft and they are parallel, then the angle to the driveshaft created by that misalignment might be sufficient to provide the needed angular differential needed for loading the U-joint bearings and reducing negative harmonics. Even when clear rules exist, the track officials are often reluctant to enforce them. 4m.net - The Most Opinionated Racing Message Board In The Universe We can run different sized lowering blocks, but that is not the same as a weight jack from a "quick adjustment" perspective. Every year, Jack asks drivers for input regarding rules changes for the following year. I would say 99's priorities worked just fine. ; this was with all four stock trailing arms. . The setup we choose needs to be arranged so that the dynamics are balanced between the front and the rear suspensions. Try to understand how aero downforce is created and then configure your car so that you take advantage of every area where you could produce more downforce. Officials are trained to find sneaky parts. I appreciate the lead. I ran a street stock/sportsman from 1995 to 2000 with a metric frame. camaro street stock setup camaro street stock setup jp. . Hobby Stock - (USRA/IMCA TYPE) Street Stock - (WISSOTA TYPE) Stock Car - (USRA/IMCA TYPE) This is very "old school" but when applied with a balanced setup, very effective. Built to the same high standards of safety, quality and craftsmanship that has made Port City Racecars an industry leader. I noticed the camaros can arch or de arch springs. I can understand not allowing alot of stuff from a cost perspective but weight jacks seem to be one of those things that are cheap to begin with and you end up spending 3 times as much money and alot more time trying to get the same result while complying with rules that don't allow them. Setup Changes For The Metric four-link Even if we can lower the rear RC to around 13 inches, that's still a high rear RC. Contact Us. Welcome to STLRacing.com, home of St. Louis Motor Racing News. 8. PDF Asphalt Modified Setup Guide - Hldm4.lambdageneration.com One guy said it come up off the ground two feet. Symptoms include bronzing on stems and petioles, curling and drying up of leave, This website uses cookies for functionality, analytics and advertising purposes as described in our. Would a 11 in be better or a 13 in spring in back be better. What Are Russet Mites? var emailHost = "hotmail.com" Cvracer5. As you will gather from this book, setting up your car right and properly maintaining it is a lot of work. 30 day Money Back Guarantee!- If you don't learn something that helps you go faster, email me and I will refund 100% of your money backAfter payment you will be directed to a download page. Biggest change is getting ride height . 1980 Camaro bomber class street stock crate motor ford 9inch. how to adjust iRacing Sprint Car cross weight, go here. The preferred way to adjust the cross weight is by moving weight around. The MC should always be somewhere close to the centerline (i.e., midway between the tire contact patches). SUCH AS SPRINGS, SHOCKS, SWAYBARS ETC. It was either cheat or park it until the rules change. I'll start out with what seems like the obvious to me - the rear suspension. It depends on your rule book and it's enforcement. So, it might be the best for asphalt racing to run as low as possible or as much as the rules allow to create a lower center of gravity. set the tone for how the parts and setup will work. See auction date, current bid, equipment specs, and seller information for each lot. As a general rule, most asphalt stock cars run around 3.5 to 4.0 front roll center height, although many run lower roll centers than they would like simply because the stock location is very low . The influence of the location of the front MC can be compared to a sliding scale. Yea how many years ago a1? Conclusion With setups that use a very stiff right rear spring, the angle of the right trailing arm will need to be less than when using a conventional softer spring because that corner will move less. Not that you can't get the same handling results with shims, etc., but it's a whole lot easier to adjust the handling of the car with weigh jackers. I always knew that chassis set up had to be based on some proven theory, but I could never find a book that could tell me what that theory was. Wheels. In short, you'll get more rear grip by lowering the rear RC. So, there is a limit to how much you can get away with and still have a decent corner entry. Its hard to say without more information. Leaf springs are important when towing heavy objects.Bear with me here, this digs a little deeper into how leaf spring suspensions work. Thanks a lot for making it. Sep 1, 2009. You must log in or register to reply here. LOL. So, we must make due and set up these cars the best we can. Cra bomber, turbo ,etc. Load the setup in the iRacing simulation under Garage - My Setups. Street stock, pure stock, sportsman, factory stock. Refer to the images below. Antidive and antisquat are mechanical influences that can help our transitional phases of entry and exit. View all S3SS. Anderson , IN. I think with the panard bar and 3rd link the metric cars. They should be matched up within a couple of degrees of average temperature across the tread. 266. If your vehicle of choice utilizes a McPherson strut style front suspension, then your 2 pivot points would be . I have had a lot of feedback from teams who did the same with the same results. I don't get too many reports of continual, repeated wins and successes. Lift earlier, and/or drag the brake just a little bit on entry. I dont really recommend it. Probably to the guys that are beating you! Add to Cart. Special Discount Cost- $24.95 !To download a copy of the E-book, simplyclick on the link below. Forum Actions: Forum Statistics: Threads: 4; Posts: 10; Last Post: I-44 Speedway-Jeg's Master of. This guide was awesome! Its important to make even adjustments, meaning you should make the same number of clicks on each spring perch. Is this why Im wearing out the right front? I would get the metric arms from Speedway P-N 910-31134-RH (LH) they are 8.0 and 8.5 long. THAT ARE CHEAP AND APPEAR STOCK. Told me he might be going to Lebanon to run now. Has gone 1.29 60 ft on spray, has 28 10.5 et street tires on it also. As the rear end rotates on acceleration, the left wheel moves rearward more so than the right wheel, creating a slight amount of rear steer to the left. The Camaro's we were running against could have weight jacks and tubular uppers as well so it was pretty even. I will post as I no longer race, the biggest thing is the angle of the upper and lower control arms in the rear, you need to understand roll center and instant center to be able to adjust it correctly. A complete body comes with the fiberglass hood and roof, plastic MD3 nose and tail, a set of skirts, trunk, a box of rivets. Loss of efficiency can rob power from the drivetrain due to the generation of vibrations and harmonics that are also damaging to the bearings. JP, are you saying that you were allowed to run it in that form - stock lowers with an aftermarket upper link? Ill also answer a couple of common questions: These changes are applicable to all asphalt oval cars. However, they should be required to run he two stock lower rear trailing arms in their stock locations. I followed the progress of the THR #01 SS very closely and when Terry says he tried everything legally possible to get that rear end to quit binding up during body roll, he's not exagerating. Note the new cross weight and the ride heights. No matter which stiffness you decide to go with, the most important aspect of setup is balance, and you achieve that balance with the correct combination of springs, moment centers, sway bars, and load distribution. Stock cars using the metric-style four-link rear suspension usually need to do this just to achieve a balanced setup with the high rear moment centers in those cars. Often overlooked in the mainstream, dirt track racing is one of the most exciting forms of tire-scorching car racing action. There is one IC for the upper links and one for the lower links. pretty much none of that ++*% matters at stateline, it is mostly driver and survival is the name of the game, get all your angles and roll centers figured out and you will be faster when you make it to the front i have seen dozens of cars that dominate in the stock class at stateline but get squashed at eriez and rw7 however once you get a car fast at either of those tracks then you will be fast everywhere you go. The upper BJ is trying to be forced in a forward direction and the lower BJ is trying to be forced in a rearward direction. #1. As the car is lowered, the rear RC will generally move down. Contact Us. We took all the cross out like Lee and trailed the RR and did not use much stagger. For the most accurate Setup and Tech Support, download our Scale & Setup Sheet, fill it out with as much information as you can and then fax it to us at 402-228-4796. The car may or may not be neutral in handling, but the handling will not be consistent. I would run either the pure stock or street stock class. Bilstein Stock Car Shock Package Fits the popular metric chassis (4) Front shocks (3) Rear Shocks Stock Mount front and rear Additional Features Nitrogen Gas . Car went anywhere he wanted and was quick time, won the trophy dash, heat race and main.